Austerlitz result draw 1:1

[Jacquinot]

Yes , the main target is that you say.
But there is also a big problem of Langeron and Pribischewski.
We have make a historical battle until 8 o'clok.
Napo wait that the 2 columns go down from Pratzen to attack Milarodovich.
For Napo this should to be a advantage for him.
Because
1)Was confident that the defence to Solkonitz was good.
    We have to think to goldbach a torrent with little bridges for to cross it (zone easy to defende)
2)Surprise on Pratzen for Miloradovich.

In our battle Sokolnitz is not a zone easy to defend , in addition Soult corp here is all detached and not good to maneuver in defense.
If Langeron and Pribischewski take Sokolnitz early, take also LOP and the battle is end.

I think Davout and Legran defend good in Sokolnitz and Telnitz until 11.00, main problem to defeat Kolowrat-Miloradovich, when you attack 4th column i give order to Miloradovich to defend line, maybe if im order to continue the march you will defeat him.

[Alfiere]

Yes , also this is true.
In history Miloradovich surprise invert march and do not defende and probabily with low moral,while you defende position.
But if Sokolnitz after 11.00 falls , then LOP is taken and all is lost.
So i must move Guard and can not use it for counterattack allied.
The problem is that guard do not defeat early the 2 columns because are elite(for me is not right.)
However we have played a variant of Austerlitz.

[Jacquinot]

Yes , also this is true.
In history Miloradovich surprise invert march and do not defende and probabily with low moral,while you defende position.
But if Sokolnitz after 11.00 falls , then LOP is taken and all is lost.
So i must move Guard and can not use it for counterattack allied.
The problem is that guard do not defeat early the 2 columns because are elite(for me is not right.)
However we have played a variant of Austerlitz.

About 2nd column i think point is that commander of 1st 2nd and 3th column was general Buxowden who was realy bad commander, i think if i do not large assault on Soklnitze and Telnitze but attack column after column like him and not counterattack the guard i think left wing would be broken.

[Jacquinot]

Summary - I think Napoleon owes his victory to mistakes of Russian and Austria generals and low moral level of Coalition army.
With high moral and with good orders Napoleon would be crushed like in our variant.

P.S. For me i cant understand one thing - how Miloradovich and Kolowrat cant see 50.000 frenchmans coming up on hill and do nothing to organize defence.

[Alfiere]

I'd like to repeat this battle (hoping there is not a all retreat movements how this time)
but with some changes,maybe wait 2 weeks.

4 symbolic corps for Soult.
LOP on the left of french (direction of Brunn)
use orendel OOB of Austerlitz.(119ceh vs 144ceh)
starting a Solo Mode Both side with the same situation at 8 o'clock (historical) of our battle.
Every hours i make a copy of sav file with the time,so if we have to repeat some action is more easy start with right file.
Next time i want to try with Bernadotte that attack Blasowith (how history),for support Vandamme and St,Hilaire and make a diversion,but i think very difficult , but will be exactly how history.
But for your side Miloradovich must invert the march at the first contact on Pratzen and do not defend.
Our is not a challenge only a attempt of simulation.
What do you think ?

[gazfun]

Summary - I think Napoleon owes his victory to mistakes of Russian and Austria generals and low moral level of Coalition army.
With high moral and with good orders Napoleon would be crushed like in our variant.

P.S. For me i cant understand one thing - how Miloradovich and Kolowrat cant see 50.000 frenchmans coming up on hill and do nothing to organize defence.

Did you have fog in your battle?

[Alfiere]

No , we have set hot and dry.
Fog historical only from 6 to 8 o'clock.

[Alfiere]

This is Soult corp of Orendel OOB
I want make 3  symbolic corps.  ST.Hilaire,Vandamme and Soult at Sokolnitz

Soult                                      Corps  IV                                
....Division Legrand                    
    ....Brigade Brouard                  
        ....Hulot........................  Btn des Tirailleurs du Pô................  Infantrymen:  602 * Battalions:  1
    ....Brigade Levasseur                
        ....Pouget.......................  26 me Rgt d'Infanterie Légère............  Infantrymen: 1205 * Battalions:  2
    ....Brigade Merle                    
        ....Schobert.....................  3/18/75 RdILi............................  Infantrymen: 3614 * Battalions:  6
    ........D'Aboville...................  1 Artillerie à Pied Cnie.................  12_Pounders:  8 Howitzers  :  4
....Division Margaron                    
    ........Bessières....................  11/26 ChaCh..............................  Cavalrymen :  854 * Squadrons :  6
    ........Laborde......................  8 me Régiment de Hussards................  Cavalrymen :  427 * Squadrons :  3
....Division St Hilaire                  
    ....Brigade Morand                  
        ....Mazas........................  14/36 RIdLI..............................  Infantrymen: 2410 * Battalions:  4
    ....Brigade Thiebault                
        ....Pouzet.......................  10 me Rgt d'Infanterie Légère............  Infantrymen: 1205 * Battalions:  2
    ....Brigade Varez                    
        ....Lemarois.....................  43/55 RIdLI..............................  Infantrymen: 2410 * Battalions:  4
    ........D'Aboville...................  1 Artillerie à Pied Cnie.................  12_Pounders:  8 Howitzers  :  4
....Division Suchet                      
    ....Brigade Becker                  
        ....Dejean.......................  34/40 RdILi..............................  Infantrymen: 2410 * Battalions:  4
    ....Brigade Claparede                
        ....Curial.......................  88 me Rgt d'Infanterie de Lign...........  Infantrymen: 1807 * Battalions:  3
    ....Brigade Valhubert                
        ....Nérin........................  64 me Rgt d'Infanterie de Lign...........  Infantrymen: 1807 * Battalions:  3
    ........D'Aboville...................  1 Artillerie à Pied Cnie.................  12_Pounders:  8 Howitzers  :  4
....Division Vandamme                    
    ....Brigade Caudras                  
        ....Latrille de Lorencez.........  46/57 RdILi..............................  Infantrymen: 2410 * Battalions:  4
    ....Brigade Ferrey                  
        ....Bonaparte Joseph.............  4/28 RdILi...............................  Infantrymen: 2410 * Battalions:  4
    ....Brigade Schinner                
        ....Marion.......................  24 me Rgt d'Infanterie Légère............  Infantrymen: 1205 * Battalions:  2
    ........D'Aboville...................  1 Artillerie à Pied Cnie.................  12_Pounders:  8 Howitzers  :  4

    Strength:25640 * Guns: 48 Infantrymen:23495 * Battalions: 39 Cavalrymen : 1281 * Squadrons :  9

[Alfiere]

This all , only strength for some considering.

1)About 12000 men of ST.Hilaire and Vandamme   against 17000 of Miloradovich and Kollowrath
2) Soult at Sokolnitz +Imperial french Guard  Strength: 12000 + 2945   against II and III Column ->Strength (10915+8716)
3)Davout 11680 at Telnitz against Dokhturov+Kutusov  6700+13880
4)Lannes+Bernadotte+Murat (8802+7128+12368)  against Bagration+Constantine+Lictenstein  (13348+10258+5703)

Only Napo can make a great victory.
@Jacquinot for me is better read a book instead to simulate a similar battle next time with hope to win.(mission impossible)

HistWar : Order Of Battle Editor

Austerlitz119x144 Year 1805

***         Napoléon I                                 Army                                       ***
Mortier                                    Imperial Guard                          
    Strength: 2945 * Guns: 12 Infantrymen: 1806 * Battalions:  3 Cavalrymen :  907 * Squadrons :  7

Bernadotte                                 Corps  I                                
    Strength: 7128 * Guns: 36 Infantrymen: 4820 * Battalions:  8 Cavalrymen : 1708 * Squadrons : 12

Davout                                     Corps  III                              
    Strength:11680 * Guns: 24 Infantrymen:10845 * Battalions: 18 Cavalrymen :  427 * Squadrons :  3

Soult                                     Corps  IV                                
    Strength:25640 * Guns: 48 Infantrymen:23495 * Battalions: 39 Cavalrymen : 1281 * Squadrons :  9

Lannes                                     Corps  V                                
    Strength: 8802 * Guns: 18 Infantrymen: 7229 * Battalions: 12 Cavalrymen : 1281 * Squadrons :  9

Murat                                      Corps  VI                                
    Strength:12368 * Guns: 60 Infantrymen: 1807 * Battalions:  3 Cavalrymen : 9609 * Squadrons : 69
 
Total  
Strength:68563 * Guns:198 Infantrymen:50002 * Battalions: 83 Cavalrymen :15213 * Squadrons :109



***         Alexander I                                Army                                       ***
Kutusov                                    Avantgarde                              
    Strength: 6693 * Guns: 24 Infantrymen: 3360 * Battalions:  5 Cavalrymen : 2941 * Squadrons : 21

Dokhturov                                  Column  I                                
    Strength:13880 * Guns: 22 Infantrymen:13504 * Battalions: 24 Cavalrymen :    0 * Squadrons :  0

Langeron                                   Column  II                              
    Strength:10915 * Guns: 12 Infantrymen:10699 * Battalions: 17 Cavalrymen :    0 * Squadrons :  0

Prebyshevsky                              Column  III                              
    Strength: 8716 * Guns: 12 Infantrymen: 8000 * Battalions: 16 Cavalrymen :  500 * Squadrons :  4

Miloradovitch                              Column  IV                              
    Strength: 7308 * Guns: 46 Infantrymen: 6500 * Battalions: 12 Cavalrymen :    0 * Squadrons :  0

Kolowrat Krakowsky                         Austrians                                
    Strength:10825 * Guns: 12 Infantrymen:10653 * Battalions: 16 Cavalrymen :    0 * Squadrons :  0

Liechtenstein                              Cavalry                                  
    Strength: 5703 * Guns: 16 Infantrymen:    0 * Battalions:  0 Cavalrymen : 5439 * Squadrons : 41

Bagration                                 Right Wing                              
    Strength:13348 * Guns: 20 Infantrymen: 8500 * Battalions: 15 Cavalrymen : 4500 * Squadrons : 34

Constantine                                Russian Imperial Guard                  
    Strength:10258 * Guns: 32 Infantrymen: 6830 * Battalions: 10 Cavalrymen : 2900 * Squadrons : 17

Total    
Strength:87646 * Guns:196 Infantrymen:68046 * Battalions:115 Cavalrymen :16280 * Squadrons :117

[Jacquinot]

I'd like to repeat this battle (hoping there is not a all retreat movements how this time)
but with some changes,maybe wait 2 weeks.

4 symbolic corps for Soult.
LOP on the left of french (direction of Brunn)
use orendel OOB of Austerlitz.(119ceh vs 144ceh)
starting a Solo Mode Both side with the same situation at 8 o'clock (historical) of our battle.
Every hours i make a copy of sav file with the time,so if we have to repeat some action is more easy start with right file.
Next time i want to try with Bernadotte that attack Blasowith (how history),for support Vandamme and St,Hilaire and make a diversion,but i think very difficult , but will be exactly how history.
But for your side Miloradovich must invert the march at the first contact on Pratzen and do not defend.
Our is not a challenge only a attempt of simulation.
What do you think ?

Im agree, who will make new OOB and deployment?

[Alfiere]

I think to modify map for LOP.
I work for deployment with orendel OOB (with 3 corps for Soult) in the same situation how our battle at 8 o'clock.
When i ready update here.
Only a question , in the orendel OOB there is Kutusov (in think how Kienmayer in our battle)?
Hello

[Jacquinot]

I think to modify map for LOP.
I work for deployment with orendel OOB (with 3 corps for Soult) in the same situation how our battle at 8 o'clock.
When i ready update here.
Only a question , in the orendel OOB there is Kutusov (in think how Kienmayer in our battle)?
Hello

For me, i dont like Orendel OOBs, i try to use his OOB for Borodino and Shevrdino and go to resume that JMM OOBs is better. Kutusov was nominal commander of Alied army and stay with 4th column.
What is LOP?

[Alfiere]

ok, then will work with JMM OOB and divide Soult Corp in 4 corps.
St.Hilaire,Vandamme,Soult at Sokolnitz and a corp for ART (already present Songis).

[Alfiere]

Map ready
JMM OOB ready

So make two different battle in PBEM (together) and see what OOB is better.

Pic with JMM OOB at 8 o'clock.
Take a look Jacquinot
Perhaps Kienmayer and Doct more in advance ?

Orendel OOB  ready
Orendel deployment ready
see Pic
Note change Kutosov to Kienmayer (Avantgarde)
Murat seems strong
Langeron only 1 elite and Prebyshevsky none.(for me is right)
Only a question is not present ART on Santon and there is not Oudinot corp.
(Orendel is historical OOB) for me good.

P.S. In the orendel OOB there was many divisions or brigades with merged regiments,i have unmerged these regiments.
example
division 4/7/9 Line inf (9000 men)  i modify in:
4  with 3000 men, another 7 with 3000, another 9 with 3000 men
 
Now we have to talking about about option for PBEM.

[Jacquinot]

I think we should play JMMs OOB, no Songis artillery, no Oudinot grenadiers, i dont like it.
What about PBEM settings?
Yes i think Kienmayer must be little more in advance.