Auteur Sujet: Column of companies  (Lu 2930 fois)

Hors ligne Count von Csollich

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Column of companies
« le: 07 janvier 2010, 20:38:54 pm »
As I fought yet another battle, and found myself in a nasty snowstorm, blowing in the faces of my "braves"...I stumbled over one thing I found quite surprising...

I had a closer look on one of my units, and it had formed column of companies... WITH SKIRMISHERS deployed??? The button for the skirmishers was red (so activated...) but I didn't see any  skirmishers marching up front (according to my knowledge...this would be the exception anyway...)
Why does this happen automatically...
can anyone explain this? (does it happen on purpose?) - or has this already been talked about?

« Modifié: 07 janvier 2010, 20:50:51 pm par Count von Csollich »
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Re : Column of companies
« Réponse #1 le: 08 janvier 2010, 00:18:14 am »
The manual mentions one formation where skirmishers will be deployed.  They're quite a distance ahead of the formation, and I've seen them several times.  I wonder if they deployed because of the poor visibility.

Hook

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Re : Column of companies
« Réponse #2 le: 08 janvier 2010, 08:13:40 am »
Yes...I've seen that too... in line and in columns of batallions... but deployed in marching order?
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Re : Re : Column of companies
« Réponse #3 le: 08 janvier 2010, 10:48:11 am »
Yes...I've seen that too... in line and in columns of batallions... but deployed in marching order?

column of batallions does not exist. There are battalions formed in line (also called battle formation), in colomn by divisions (2 cies front, 3 or more ranks deep), in column by company (also called column by peloton :1 cy or peloton front and 6 or more deep), in column by section (also called march column : half cy front).

Column by divisions and column by company are march or offensive formations ; column by section is a march formation (or on occasion an offensive one, in the case of narrow places attack like bridges).

When in reports from generals you read "columns of battalions", it means that the general wants to precise that he talks about regiments formations and not division formation. if he just says : "I ordered to attack in column", it means that is division was in column (1st brigade in front, 2nd brigade behind the 1st)
“Jamais d’aultres armes nous prendront, que celles que nous élisons ; et nous disons pour réconfort, nous voulons la liberté ou la mort !”

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Re : Column of companies
« Réponse #4 le: 08 janvier 2010, 14:31:36 pm »
That's precisely why a tried to avoid the expression "column of divisions"...I should have expressed and explained it better...  :lol:
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Re : Column of companies
« Réponse #5 le: 08 janvier 2010, 15:10:09 pm »
There were a number of mentions of "column of squads" in the manual, along with "column of divisions", and they were always talking about infantry at the time.  I changed all the "column of squads" to read "column of platoons".  Is this proper terminology?

Hook

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Re : Column of companies
« Réponse #6 le: 08 janvier 2010, 15:14:50 pm »
I believe that column of companies is used more often...but I think everybody understands what's ment by that...
« Modifié: 08 janvier 2010, 15:16:34 pm par Count von Csollich »
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Re : Re : Column of companies
« Réponse #7 le: 08 janvier 2010, 16:14:54 pm »
There were a number of mentions of "column of squads" in the manual, along with "column of divisions", and they were always talking about infantry at the time.  I changed all the "column of squads" to read "column of platoons".  Is this proper terminology?
Hook

If in English "platoon" means half a company, your translation is right (this column is also called "march column"). The real terminology should be "column by platoon".

It might have a translation mistake in book 1 page 25 : "colonne par peloton" has been translated by "column of platoon". In the case, a platoon is half a company this translation is wrong and must be "column by company".
“Jamais d’aultres armes nous prendront, que celles que nous élisons ; et nous disons pour réconfort, nous voulons la liberté ou la mort !”

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Re : Re : Column of companies
« Réponse #8 le: 08 janvier 2010, 16:33:38 pm »
That's precisely why a tried to avoid the expression "column of divisions"...I should have expressed and explained it better...  :lol:

column by division is the right terminology to explain your battalions are form with two companies front (a division is a couple of companies).

I know it can be confusing because in terminology the difference between "column of division" and "column by division" is slim. In the first case, it means division must be formed with 1st brigade in front and second brigade behind and in the second case, it means the battalions must be formed in columns of two companies front. There is also confusion with terminology during Empire. Some historians and even Jomini stated that it might be a misunderstanding of that kind that took place for the formation of the 1st corps in Waterloo.
“Jamais d’aultres armes nous prendront, que celles que nous élisons ; et nous disons pour réconfort, nous voulons la liberté ou la mort !”

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Re : Column of companies
« Réponse #9 le: 08 janvier 2010, 17:57:45 pm »
Mon General thanks for that clarification, because in German this problem does not exist... but good to know... :mrgreen: :!: :!:
« Modifié: 08 janvier 2010, 18:02:10 pm par Count von Csollich »
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Re : Column of companies
« Réponse #10 le: 08 janvier 2010, 18:29:11 pm »
The peleton is a military formation whereas a company is understood in the French army of the time as an administrative term.  Usually each peleton would br formed by a company but if understrength the number of files making up a section (and therby a peleton) could vary from the number of files you might expect.

Best to consider "column of companies" as equivalent to "colonne par peleton"

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Re : Re : Column of companies
« Réponse #11 le: 09 janvier 2010, 13:18:43 pm »
Mon General thanks for that clarification, because in German this problem does not exist... but good to know... :mrgreen: :!: :!:

Yes, I know. It's a specific French vocabulary problem.
“Jamais d’aultres armes nous prendront, que celles que nous élisons ; et nous disons pour réconfort, nous voulons la liberté ou la mort !”