Sieges

[dmcheatw]

I ask in the battleforn forum before it was closed if there would be sieges.  I was told unofficailly that there would be sieges at a later date in an expansion.  i was just wondering if 1) sieges were still planned in an expansion and 2) if that would be a free expansion or cost money?

as many of you enthusiasts know, 19th century siege warfare could be a game unto itself.  So i was wondering if JMM was going to include such complexity in a game that is already very complex and ambitious, or if it was going to be in a different game altogether (if at all)?

any info would be appreciated.

[Montecuccoli]

For what i know by now regarding sieges, they will be implemented in the expansion regarding Campaigns, i think that they won't be tactical sieges but they will remain just in the strategic view... a similar thing was in the game Napoleon 1813, where sieges were present but only at a strategic level.

[dmcheatw]

thank you monte, that is very clear and exciting!  good to hear JMM isn't planning on trying to make the tactics of a siege battle (yet?) as that would be very difficult indeed.

i hope one day either as an expansion or as a totally new game he makes real time tactical 19th century sieges... he is the only person on the planet who could pull it off i'm convinced!

[Darsh]

Sieges would be an wonderful idea, Imagine Ulm or Borodino.

[Pariente]

I think La Moskowa is already playable in HW:LG...

[lodi57]

I think La Moskowa is already playable in HW:LG...

That's right, La Moskowa/Borodino is one of the battles included in LG.  Darsh made a mistake : there was no siege in Borodino  . I think dmcheatw talks about sieges like Danzig in 1807 or Torgau, Koenigsberg in 1813. Sieges are a very technical part of warfare, in real life I mean, it needs for artillerists and engineers a sharp study of the topography and the fortifications to storm. In fact, what is a siege : bombardments, assaults-defence of weak points, management of supplies and often a long wait. As for me, I am not sure that this kind of warfare represents a tactical interest and a long-term enjoyment. Anyway, I think it must be hard to put the feature of this kind of warfare in a game (mortars, guns, trenchs, wall resistance to gun fire, etc.).

[Darsh]

That's right, La Moskowa/Borodino is one of the battles included in LG.  Darsh made a mistake : there was no siege in Borodino  . I think dmcheatw talks about sieges like Danzig in 1807 or Torgau, Koenigsberg in 1813. Sieges are a very technical part of warfare, in real life I mean, it needs for artillerists and engineers a sharp study of the topography and the fortifications to storm. In fact, what is a siege : bombardments, assaults-defence of weak points, management of supplies and often a long wait. As for me, I am not sure that this kind of warfare represents a tactical interest and a long-term enjoyment. Anyway, I think it must be hard to put the feature of this kind of warfare in a game (mortars, guns, trenchs, wall resistance to gun fire, etc.).

well it's true that Borodina isn't a siege technically but there were redoubts to take.

[lodi57]

well it's true that Borodina isn't a siege technically but there were redoubts to take.

Course, but redoubts are field fortifications and do not need to be sieged to be attacked  .

[dmcheatw]

That's right, La Moskowa/Borodino is one of the battles included in LG.  Darsh made a mistake : there was no siege in Borodino  . I think dmcheatw talks about sieges like Danzig in 1807 or Torgau, Koenigsberg in 1813. Sieges are a very technical part of warfare, in real life I mean, it needs for artillerists and engineers a sharp study of the topography and the fortifications to storm. In fact, what is a siege : bombardments, assaults-defence of weak points, management of supplies and often a long wait. As for me, I am not sure that this kind of warfare represents a tactical interest and a long-term enjoyment. Anyway, I think it must be hard to put the feature of this kind of warfare in a game (mortars, guns, trenchs, wall resistance to gun fire, etc.).

yes there is no question in my mind how difficult it would be to pull off and still be fun.  that's probably why nobody has done it yet.  TW, for instance, doesn't come anywhere close.

[Pariente]

they won't be tactical sieges but they will remain just in the strategic view... a similar thing was in the game Napoleon 1813, where sieges were present but only at a strategic level.

What do you mean by « strategic sieges » ?

Won't we see Maréchal de Vauban's siege tactics and fortresses ?

[Montecuccoli]

Strategic sieges i meant sieges will be used (i suppose now) in the strategic map and not in a tactical way (not like the game stronghold for example); i was thinking about Empires in Arms or Crown of Glory

[lodi57]

Strategic sieges i meant sieges will be used (i suppose now) in the strategic map and not in a tactical way (not like the game stronghold for example); i was thinking about Empires in Arms or Crown of Glory

I think it will be this way too. May be to implement sharp calculation based on moral between attacker and defender. So you can have a combat result without fighting any battle in 3D.

[lodi57]

It may be interesting for us to check what kind of features we'd like to see in a siege warfare game video for tactical and operationnal purposes. So what kind of features will you expect ?

[Pariente]

Besieging, I would expect :

- historical fortresses (bastions, glacis, star fort, etc.)
- fortifications : trenches, ravelins, ditches, curtain walls, etc.
- tactics : parallel trenches, surrounding, mining, sorties, etc.
- equipment and soldiers : siege artillery, mortars, sappers, etc.

But I don't know  how we would play four-month sieges in a couple hours !